[Bucsfan]

I saw the sticky on the ES fix by kentco with white lithium grease. My 01 foreman 450es was temper-mental (but working) when shifting so I figured I'd try this fix. Well I messed up and pulled the control motor housing as opposed to the whole assembly. the magnetic force brought the motor with it and had the a couple springs let go on me. I managed to get everything back together properly continued to clean up the gears and applied new grease. Started it up and got it to shift in reverse and then 1st but stopped working after that. So I removed the assembly again made sure everything fit together correctly and tried again. This time I got it to shift reverse but then shut off.

Could I have screwed up the control motor altogether or possibly the angle sensor? Any help/ ideas is appreciated!

 

[retro]

Does the shift motor attempt to run each time you hit a shift button? If not, check the angle sensor with a multimeter then if the sensor is in spec, take the shift motor apart and check that the brushes lengths are within spec, the brush springs are good and brushes are not sticking in rusty guides.

Grease the armature bearings front and rear and grease the seal lips during reassembly using synthetic grease. You can use two small alligator clips to hold the brushes back while you put the armature back in the nose... then remove the clips and hold onto the shaft poking out of the nose real tight while you lower the magnets housing down over the armature. Use a light coating of silicone gasket maker on the housing o-ring seal to keep water out of the motor.

While ya got it apart it would be a good idea to clean out all of the white grease and repack the reduction gears bearings. Push syn grease into each bearing with your thumb until they are full with synthetic grease. Then coat all of the reduction gears and pack grease in the gear teeth especially, using synthetic grease.

Using lithium grease just insures that ya gotta fix it again in a couple years... and you live in a cold climate area, so it'll probably fail to shift sooner than that in severe cold... so always use synthetic grease when you prepare electric shift systems. Honda recommended that crap to make money off from your back... use NLGI #2 synthetic grease only, do it right and be done with it.

If your shift switches are intermittent you'll have to take those apart for cleaning and repacking using dielectric grease for lube. Clean with an electrical spray and Dielectric grease all of the harness connectors too.

Make sure you get the reduction gears back in right or it will not shift. Info and photo is in the service manual... let us know how its going as often as you can.

 

[Bucsfan]

Thanks for the info retro. Will run some tests and go from there. So don't use the grease specified in the "sticky" ?
The brushes are not sticking! I had quite the time yesterday getting all that back together, sometimes it felt like you need 4 hands but I the clips would definitely help.

 

[Bucsfan]

Checked the angle sensor for voltage and can't get a steady reading it jumps all over the place. Manual says between 4.75-5.25 and the readings are definitely not that. I thought my meter might be malfunctioning so I tested the battery and got a steady reading of 12.67. i just find it hard to believe there is a wiring issue when it was working before I started this project. Could it be a bad ground? Is there a specific ground for the ES I could clean up and try

 

[retro]

Don't use the grease recommended in the sticky, using that stuff is what leads to failures. You saw what happens to it when you took yours apart? Honda wants you to use that grease cause the bikes break down a lot more often. Reliability disappears and folks buy parts they don't need. Use synthetic grease to fix it right. If you do a thorough job on the gears and bearings the ES will work better than it did when it was new. You will notice huge improvements right away and the ES motor & related parts will last a lot longer, even in sub-zero temps.

Make sure that each reduction gear bearing was installed straight from the factory... I have seen many bearings that were cocked in the bores and not installed deep enough in their bores, which causes binding of the gears and causes them to rub hard on the aluminum cases, creating deep gouges. Straighten each bearing using a plastic screwdriver handle then pack them full of syn.

If you use two small alligator clips to hold the brushes back assembly of the motor is easy. Lube the bearings with syn and seal it watertight with silicone gasket maker.

If your angle sensor is not providing linear readings then it is bad. Use an OEM sensor only and be careful that you match the drive flats with the end of the shift spindle when you put the new sensor on. Use a thin coating of gasket maker on clean, dry surfaces to seal it watertight. Do not overtighten the two mounting bolts.

All connector plugs must be cleaned and dielectric greased to make them waterproof. They NOT waterproof from the factory, you gotta do that...

Final tip: Do not overtighten any of the bolts on the ES system. If you do the aluminum cover will warp and cause gears to bind up.

Keep us posted if you can.

 

[retro]

Always begin every ES shift system diagnosis with a thorough cleaning and dielectric greasing of every harness connector. The majority of ES shift electrical issues are caused by dirty/wet/corroded harness plugs. Remember. they are NOT waterproofed from the factory. Ain't no money in that for Honda....

 

[Bucsfan]

Okay so I'll admit I'm an amateur with a multi meter and pretty sure the angle sensor is fine! I figured out how to narrow down the range and got a steady 4.89 reading which is well within the preferred reading. Then I removed the angle sensor and measured the resistance between the other two terminals and it seems to be responding correctly. Since then I've removed the control motor assembly and ready to test for movement but got pre occupied with my brothers outer tie rod ends on his car. First time I've had to cut one out of the knuckle so that was interesting! Sorry to leave you hanging but will reply with results at the next checkpoint! Thanks retro you're experience is priceless!!

 

[Bucsfan]

So the shift control motor wasn't working when I supplied power. Bought a new one and everything is working good! The shifting is way more responsive! That old black gummy grease definitely creates some friction on those gears. Now are there any tricks to making the old one work again? Figured it would be nice to have if I can get it working

 

[retro]

Yeah, take the shift motor completely apart and look everything over. You might find a brush lead broken or something... theres a gazillion possibilities. You can check whether the commutator/armature is good or not using a multimeter on resistance mode. Thats usually covered in the FSM but if you can't find it hollar, cause checking pairs for opens or shorts is real simple. Take pics and post them up if ya got any questions...?

I have a 2000 450ES that was dropped off a couple days ago, needing diagnosis and repair of the charging system. I intend to prep the ES on this bike before I release it to the owner, so if you need some reference pics of the shift motor parts don't hesitate to ask...

Congrats on getting your ES prepped! I knew that you'd be impressed with it, once it was properly done! ES shifts are fast, almost instant, and very easy on the trans provided you keep the clutch adjusted. Have fun with it!

 

[Bucsfan]

Thanks for the help! I'll tinker with the old one and see if I can find the problem.