2017 Rubicon first 20 hr. service
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I suspect strongly the majority of people have not followed the manual regarding valve adjustment, especially at the 20 hr mark, self included. Valve adjustment is not complicated, but technical, see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qwx_3drOCuw I am confident the majority of ATV owners overlook valve adjusting for years/miles/hours and personally would not do it at 20 hours unless I felt it was needed, i.e., valve clattering and likely wait until the second oil change or another 50 hours or so.
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2,608 Posts
But I'd still change the oil at that 20 hour point. Read your owners manual and don't put just any old oil in your wet clutch bike. The oil must be "JASO MA" rated for wet clutch engines.
Also use extreme caution when reinstalling the oil filter. Take notes, shoot a picture with your phone - whatever - but you have a 50-50 shot of putting the filter in backwards and starving your engine for oil . . . thus destroying your motor.
Rick
Also use extreme caution when reinstalling the oil filter. Take notes, shoot a picture with your phone - whatever - but you have a 50-50 shot of putting the filter in backwards and starving your engine for oil . . . thus destroying your motor.
Rick
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170 Posts
Agree with everyone above. Unless the valves are making noise I wouldn't adjust/check them until the next oil change. That's what I'm doing to my Rubicon. I doubt at 20hrs the engine is even fully broke-in yet.
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8,309 Posts
also keep in MIND< warranty , if you have a LONGER than Factory one, or?? you will NEED to prove these basic
s were done if anything goes wrong and they ask for them
having HONDA do the service, takes care of this, and why some do so
NOT having PROOF< of an oil change at "X" hrs/miles, or what ever, is the LOOPHOLE< many company's live by! to save them repair bills
so food for thought!
s were done if anything goes wrong and they ask for them
having HONDA do the service, takes care of this, and why some do so
NOT having PROOF< of an oil change at "X" hrs/miles, or what ever, is the LOOPHOLE< many company's live by! to save them repair bills
so food for thought!
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170 Posts
It's interesting people talk about the dealer doing the all maintenance and how you are "protected". Nothing wrong with them doing it at all. I will have them do my 600 mile service. But if you have an internal engine failure and there is a hint of water in there I bet you could kiss that warranty goodbye. I have all the receipts, old filter and a few pics of me changing the oil. If a dealer told me something wasn't covered due to lack of maintenance I would be calling Honda and then the FTC. There are laws that protect you from situations where your warranty could be denied. Just like adding aftermarket parts doesn't void your warranty.
And here's something interesting, my dealer told me not to worry about changing my oil at the 100 mile/20hr mark. He said you can go up to about 200-300 miles. He also told me not to worry about the valves until the 600 mile service. I changed my oil at 102 miles and I'm glad I did. I was surprised at the amount of shavings in it. Which I'm assuming is NORMAL!?!?!
And here's something interesting, my dealer told me not to worry about changing my oil at the 100 mile/20hr mark. He said you can go up to about 200-300 miles. He also told me not to worry about the valves until the 600 mile service. I changed my oil at 102 miles and I'm glad I did. I was surprised at the amount of shavings in it. Which I'm assuming is NORMAL!?!?!
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I did the 100 mile adjustment on my new foreman myself and do all of my own maintenance and it did make a difference in performance.
Don't forget the motor is brand new and is breaking in and that it why it is called for at such low hours. Regular valve adjustments are well worth the effort and after you figure it out the first time, it will get easier for you to do.
Don't forget the motor is brand new and is breaking in and that it why it is called for at such low hours. Regular valve adjustments are well worth the effort and after you figure it out the first time, it will get easier for you to do.
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8,309 Posts
I am going to say your WRONG on a few things here, first if the dealer TELLS you NOT to follow the owners manuals SET times for PM"s , HONDA will tell you , your screwed, HAVE the dealer PAY for things if things go wrong, a dealer cannot superseded HONDA"S Spec's for when HONDA requires things done
and GOOD luck getting a dealer to SAY he TOLD you NOT to follow what's in your owners manual?
that's asking for a a HE SAID< SHE SAID conversation , you will end up loosing out on!
NEXT, as for Aftermarket parts NOT voiding a warranty
ANY time you ALTER the design by the maker, you can VOID your warranty, as you did NOT allow it to be used as OEM designed it
NOW will many dealers NOT fix something if you have larger tires on it or a pipe,
NO, MOST will turn a BLIND eye to it
BUT if they wanted to be sticks in the mud YES they most certainly CAN
the burden of PROOF< is tossed around a LOT on the web
some say the OEM must PROVE that the "X" part cause "X" problem
and legally as far as MY understanding goes, NO
it would NOT
all they would have to prove, is it was NOT in OEM condition
you would have to PROVE it DIDN"T cause"X" failure
and that will fall on you to PROVE, can very easy cost you more to do so that worth doing, and OEM"S know this
TAKING pictures?? sound's great, but vide would be better, as anything today can about be MADE
a HONDA dealer( and NO I do NOT use mine for about ANYTHING)
has certified techs, and blah blah blah, BUT when work gets done there, they get the BLAME IF something goes wrong , 10 times more than IF you do it and something fails
this will really come down to YOUR dealer and HOW Much a jerk or OK shop they are
they can BACK you or NOT, when THEY DIDN"T do ":X" work and problems develop
the thing I think MOST atv owners do is this
they BOUGHT a TOY, they use/abuse it, add what they WANT when they WANT< FIX when and as they wish
and IF problems happen, MOST suck it up as" SH!T IT HAPPENS"
so few fight the warranty deal any ways
but YES aftermarket parts can and WILL void warrantys, read the small print on a warranty some time? LOL
Sorry, just is what it is!
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172 Posts
I did the 100 mile service on 2 quads and noted the following:
1) - small amount of metal filings from each quad, maybe 0.1 gram each.
2) 1 valve on each quad was tight by .002. I loosened them. I suspect they were set as such at the factory, and that they were more accurate, since they set under "laboratory conditions", and not in the shop. But I couldn't leave them tight.
3) Putting the filter back in correctly was easy-peasy, but only because the forum pointed out the issue that there is also a wrong way. Had I not known, then I wouldn't even have thought about it, and had a 50% chance of failure. Reading the manual also would have helped, but who reads a book to change oil?
4) Setting the valves was easy, and done with normal tools, including a bent feeler gauge. Interestingly, the "kid" at the car shop didn't even know what a feeler gauge was, much less a bent one.
1) - small amount of metal filings from each quad, maybe 0.1 gram each.
2) 1 valve on each quad was tight by .002. I loosened them. I suspect they were set as such at the factory, and that they were more accurate, since they set under "laboratory conditions", and not in the shop. But I couldn't leave them tight.
3) Putting the filter back in correctly was easy-peasy, but only because the forum pointed out the issue that there is also a wrong way. Had I not known, then I wouldn't even have thought about it, and had a 50% chance of failure. Reading the manual also would have helped, but who reads a book to change oil?
4) Setting the valves was easy, and done with normal tools, including a bent feeler gauge. Interestingly, the "kid" at the car shop didn't even know what a feeler gauge was, much less a bent one.
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170 Posts
I agree with you on the maintenance part. Hence why I CHANGED my oil at 102 miles. And didn't listen to what the dealer told me. Like you said, he said she said.
As far as warranties you're WRONG lol. They can not void your warranty for aftermarket parts. The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act makes it illegal for companies to void your warranty or deny coverage under the warranty simply because you used an aftermarket or recycled part. Maybe you need to educate yourself on the fine print of the LAWS lol.
https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/0138-auto-warranties-routine-maintenance
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welllllllllll, let me just point this out, and I will leave it at that. when I bought my chevy Silverado brand new in '00 ?, I asked the dealer if I could put after market exhaust ( dual pipes ) on it ?, they told me NO, it would void the warranty !. hmmm..time to read up. I contacted a exhaust place that installs exhaust systems on cars and trucks, told them what the dealer said ?, he chimed back, said, here is the deal sir, YOU CAN ADD AFTER MARKET DUAL EXHAUST ON YOUR NEW TRUCK, ONLY IF YOU INSTALL A CAT-BACK SYSTEM ?!. I asked him what this meant ?, he said, anything that is after market that is installed on your truck, bolted, welded, whatever ?, CAN ONLY BE INSTALLED FROM THE CATALATIC CONVERTER BACK !, if you install anything in front of this ?, then yes, you void your warranty !. bottom line, IT ALL DEPENDS ON WHAT AND WHERE YOU INSTALL AFTER MARKET PARTS THAT COULD OR CAN EFFECT YOUR WARRANTY !. can they void your warranty for putting on after market parts ?, no. can they void your warranty if you install after market parts in the wrong place ?, DAMN RIGHT THEY CAN !. toss a snorkel on your brand new atv, sink it, take it to the Honda dealer, see how fast they tell you, you voided your warranty !!!!..lmao.
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170 Posts
Agreed. That's exactly my point. You CAN install aftermarket parts and not void your warranty. But if whatever it is you added causes a failure then you're on your own. If you bolt on bigger tires and your engine seizes the next ride, that's the stuff you are covered from.
And you CAN do your own maintenance. And all you need are basic records of you doing it. BUT you but the filter in backwards you're on your own...
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how do you know it's your valves ?, it could be your connecting rod ?, cam chain ?, valve seat ?, a bearing ?, there are a few parts in atv motors that make a sound like a bad or lose valve ?..lol. many moons ago, I rebuilt a trx350fm rancher, damn thing sounded great when first started ?, then when I blipped the throttle, I was hearing a rattle/click sound ?, drove me nutzs !, cam chain was brand new, so, I put a brand new cam in, because I thought maybe the decompression lever on old cam was bad ?, nope, same problem, changed valves, nope, changed valve springs, nope, well, come find out, the valve spring seat would work its way out of the head when warmed up ?, I talked to my bud at my local Honda dealership, he told me sure enough, the early trx350 ranchers had a defect in the heads valve seats !.
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38,619 Posts
bottom line, you must know what your getting into, BEFORE YOU DO IT !..LOL. some mistakes we can live with ?, others ?..well..we will pay the price if it's bad enough !..lol.
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8,309 Posts
well for starters, your link doesn't work for me
second, YES SOME aftermarket parts meet or exceed OEM spec's but they are of the SAME design
as in Brake pads, and assorted parts that replace a failed OEM part
so NOT all aftermarket parts will VOID a warranty
BUT any part that chganges the way the OEM design WILL VOID the warranty
AKA< larger tires,
add more stress to drive train, changes RPM"S of motor, shift pints in trans and so on, harder on brake system!
SO they CAN void your warranty, its MANY time again, the dealer that says OK or NOT<, but it can void your warranty
adding a LIFT kit, changes angles on drive shafts
that is why the MAKERS that OFFER And SELL< trucks lifted with full warranty COST so much more than a STOCK truck and you lift it yourself
as ONCE you lift the truck yourself, you DO VOID your warranty
as again you altered OEM design
Like it or not, its a fact, go to court and I will bet you will loose
OEM pay's engineers a LOT of money to design things, and there design'
s are what save there butt's in an accident or a failure
when you use parts that ALTER OEM design
your Crap out of luck IF the dealer wished to be a jerk and NOT honor the warranty, as HE is the one who SEE"S it, to allow a claim to get started or not
going with a an aftermarket part BUILD TO SPEC of a OEM part WON"T void a warranty
its when parts ALTER OEM design
plain and simple here, its why you will find treads where folks suggest you KEEP OEM wheels and tires if you go LARGER, and then IF needed CHEAT and out back on the stock tires/parts before going back to a dealer
WHY< because having BIG tires will void a warranty
DO some dealers sell things with larger tires on them YES< do some dealers warranty them YES, does HONDA allow for this??
Odds are they turn a bliond eye to things unless dealer says NO when you walk in
BUT take that same LIFTED BIG tire atv to a dealer OTHER than the one that sold it to you, and you might find out, THEY will NOT warranty it, and DON"T have too
lots of folks buy brand new things and modify them, and most care less about warranty in doping so
some dealers again will Warranty things on THERE SIDE< NOT OEM"S, to make the sale, they roll the dice and hope they DON"T loose out
but its NOT factory warranty like deals
I happen to know quite a bit about this stuff, from learning the hard way and digging into things
SO
you might want to look more into things if you plan to mod and expect the warranty to be there, odds are you will NOT be happy!
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