2014 honda rancher won't start

9647 Views 44 Replies 6 Participants Last post by SamUK, Oct 5, 2018

hondarancher2014

Discussion Starter · Oct 1, 2018

Ok I have a 2014 honda rancher 420 4x4 foot shift. I bought it knowing it wasn't running and the guy said its a bad or stuck open injector. I pulled the injector off and turned the key and fuel was dumping out of the fuel line. put the injector on the fuel line and it was spraying when I hit the start button. Changed the spark plug and it was getting plenty of spark. I have a second 420 that I took the ECM and mass air low sensor and O2 sensor off of the bike and didn't change anything. It will sputter when you try and start it while hitting the throttle so I think it something simple but not sure. I am new to EFI so I am looking for some help. Carbs are definitely easier to work on but on to EFI.
Thanks,
Hunter

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retro

· #2 · Oct 1, 2018

Check the cylinder compression first. Adjust valves to spec. Then clean the throttle body, check & clean the IACV, make sure the sensor in the airbox is plugged in and initialize the TP/MAP sensor per the manual. You can get a copy of the FSM linked HERE. Let us know how it goes... because you may need to replace that fuel pump and filter. 420 fuel pumps are wimps. Welcome to the forums!

retro

· #7 · Oct 2, 2018

So you cleaned the rotten fuel out of it? But the fuel pump runs only while you are cranking the motor over with the starter? That sounds like a Bank Angle Sensor issue to me. Check the BAS and the fuel pump relay, cause those two work together. You should see the fuel pump run for 2 seconds each time the ignition key is turned on. Fuel pressure should read between 48-53 lbs. If it is low the motor will not start and run.

Check out section 4 and section 7 in the service manual. There is way too much info you gotta cover step-by-step for me to even think about typing up in here. But I'll try to help you if you get in a bind... let us know how it goes.

retro

· #10 · Oct 2, 2018

Check the compression first and compare the measurement to the service manual spec. If it is within spec then check the ignition timing in case the flywheel woodruff key is sheared. Then check valve timing and adjust the valves. Assuming the fuel system is alright, its probably one of those...

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retro

· #12 · Oct 2, 2018

Yep, this thing might have been hydro-locked in a pond for all we know.

retro

· #14 · Oct 3, 2018

Nevermind the valve timing until the compression is checked and ignition timing is verified. Then while you have the valve cover off for a valve adjustment you can check the cam timing. But 1st things 1st...

retro

· #20 · Oct 3, 2018

IF the compression test is within spec (if not stop right there and fix it), then check the ignition timing using a timing light while cranking the motor over with the starter. The service manual shows you how to do it through the timing access plug. If it looks like its out slightly, suspect that the woodruff key is sheared on the flywheel.

retro

· #23 · Oct 3, 2018

shadetree said:
retro said:

IF the compression test is within spec (if not stop right there and fix it), then check the ignition timing using a timing light while cranking the motor over with the starter. The service manual shows you how to do it through the timing access plug. If it looks like its out slightly, suspect that the woodruff key is sheared on the flywheel.

Click to expand...

why does he need a timing light to check the ignition timing ?, there are timing marks everywhere on that motor, if he sets the marks, sight hole, rear crank case, piston on top dead center on the compression stroke ( which can be checked by the sticky on how to set and adjust valves ) , you don't need to crank anything over with the starter. I have never used a timing light to check ignition on an atv, I go by the timing marks, valves set on the compression stroke, bam..running engine !..lol.

Because we are not talking about checking valve timing, we are talking about ignition timing possibly being out because of a sheared flywheel woodruff key. You can't check the ignition timing any other way, the motor has to be spinning.

Reactions: 1

retro

· #24 · Oct 3, 2018

Anyway, the compression test needs to be done first. If compression is low the ignition timing is obviously irrelevant. This is the logical order of every no-start diagnosis after spark and fuel are verified.

retro

· #27 · Oct 3, 2018

shadetree said:
retro said:

shadetree said:

why does he need a timing light to check the ignition timing ?, there are timing marks everywhere on that motor, if he sets the marks, sight hole, rear crank case, piston on top dead center on the compression stroke ( which can be checked by the sticky on how to set and adjust valves ) , you don't need to crank anything over with the starter. I have never used a timing light to check ignition on an atv, I go by the timing marks, valves set on the compression stroke, bam..running engine !..lol.

Click to expand...

Because we are not talking about checking valve timing, we are talking about ignition timing possibly being out because of a sheared flywheel woodruff key. You can't check the ignition timing any other way, the motor has to be spinning.

Click to expand...

correct me if I am wrong ?, but if the T mark on the flywheel, and the raised arrow behind the starter cage don't line up ?, then your right, the flywheel woodruff key can be sheared ?, but if these two marks line up ?, then he has other issues.

Because he does not have the motor taken apart, this is the diagnosis stage... a timing light is the best tool (and quickest) for this job.

I've been trying to get him to check the compression for 3 days now, but he wants to talk about all of these other things first, so thats why we are explaining them.

retro

· #33 · Oct 5, 2018

Sorry, I've been away for 24 hours working so haven't been able to help ya.

Have you swapped the fuel pump yet? I can't remember...

Check the sensors with an ohm meter (see attachment) and make sure every one of them are plugged in (the air temp sensor in the airbox too) when trying to start it.

You may have to initialize the TP/Map per the service manual. If it fails that procedure then at least you'd know what to zero in on.

Basically, everything needs to be tested to find the fault. I realize that a fuel pressure test might be impossible though. Honda didn't want the owner to be able to work on their own bike, so they made it expensive to rig a fuel pressure gauge up to them.

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retro

· #34 · Oct 5, 2018

After the motor dies while running/chugging with starter assistance, what does the spark plug look like? Is it wet or dry?

retro

· #38 · Oct 5, 2018

hondarancher2014 said:
new plug and didn't fix it

Is the new spark plug coming out wet too?

retro

· #40 · Oct 5, 2018

Is the fuel pump still running full time while you are cranking it over with the starter? Or does it shut off? Its suppose to run for 2 seconds then shut off each time the ignition switch is turned on.

retro

· #42 · Oct 5, 2018

Still back at square one then. Might be the injector, the CKP, fuel pump, jumped cam chain, sheared woodruff key, ECT sensor, IACV, TP... the list goes on. Check all that you can using a multimeter. Then read/dump codes. Initialize TP. Check the cam timing and the woodruff key. Electronics are fun, ehh?

retro

· #44 · Oct 5, 2018

2

You never checked the cam timing or the woodruff key so don't rule them out yet. Your compression tests were all over the place too... the max reading should have been about 73 PSI due to the compression release mechanism on the end of the camshaft. That might be clue... or it might just be a junk gauge setup..?

As for whats next? As I said I'd be checking all of the electrical components with the multimeter, read stored codes, initialize the TP, etc. Electrical diagnosis proceeds very quickly and requires very little disassembly.

Then after eliminating everything electrical I'd check the cam timing and the woodruff key, since those require some disassembly.

I'm not a parts replacer, so I can't help you much while you're using that approach. I'll drop some more troubleshooting info here though... keep in mind that the ignition system and PGM-FI are inter-dependent on these bikes. Rule nothing out until tested/verified.

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