[cjriddle22]

I just purchased a 2010 Rancher 420 4x4 (foot shift, manual 4x4).

When I went and looked at the quad it was in pretty good shape, but the rear brakes didn't work (parking brake and foot pedal were soft with no braking whatsoever). I knew this was probably an easy fix so I purchased the quad anyways.

I tore apart the rear brakes and everything was pretty normal. No mud or water inside the drum, just lots of brake dust. I assumed it just needed new shoes so I went about my business. Went ahead and replace all the seals, shoes, washers, etc. for what I would call an almost total rebuild. I even replaced the wing nuts, cams, and springs at the rear brake cable. Cleaned out the brake lever cam and greased everything up. Lined up the cam with the punch marks and everything seemed good to go.

Yesterday I finally put the tires back on and wanted check the brakes and make final adjustment before a ride.

I had to adjust the wing nuts at least 3/4 of the way to get any feel in the brake lever and pedal, and it still doesn't stop like I think it should. The only thing I didn't change out was the brake cables and the actual drum. From what I could tell the quad has decently low miles (original tires, appeared to be the first time anyone had opened the drum). The brake arm moves freely and returns nicely (spring is stiff). Both the pedal and lever return nicely.

I didn't check the drum specs when I had it apart (assumed it was within spec).

1) Do you think the drum could be out of spec? The old brake shoes didn't even appear seriously warn but from forums and youtube videos, that might not always be the case. I haven't ever done a brake job on a quad, just cars many times (the shoes on cars can be metal on metal and severely warn before needing replacement).

2) Could it be a cable issue? I dont think so because both cables seem to be affected the same.

Just looking for some advice before I order a new drum and bust it all open again.

 

[shadetree]

very well could be a worn brake drum.

 

[cjriddle22]

very well could be a worn brake drum.

Yeah that's what I'm thinking, but would a drum not last the life of a few pairs of shoes? I mean, it's not like it was dragging or rubbing or anything.

 

[shadetree]

very well could be a worn brake drum.

Yeah that's what I'm thinking, but would a drum not last the life of a few pairs of shoes? I mean, it's not like it was dragging or rubbing or anything.

depends ?. how was the brakes used ?, how hard was the PO owner on them ?. was the atv taken through gritty stuff a lot ?. are you 100% sure you installed the brake cam right ?. it's best to measure the drum, and see how worn it is compared to service limit specs ?. .

 

[shadetree]

what you can do is ( just a temp fix ) , rotate the brake cam back a couple splines, install, then this will give you less travel on the brake shoes before they engage the brake drum.

 

[Jeepwm69]

Yep, rotate the cam back a couple of teeth. It will give you more adjustment on the wingnuts and engage the pads quicker.

Back brakes on Hondas kinda suck. The good news is, if you have it in 4wd, and lock up the front brakes, it's gonna lock up your rear wheels too since the final shaft that runs front and rear end is the same shaft.

 

[cjriddle22]

Yep, rotate the cam back a couple of teeth. It will give you more adjustment on the wingnuts and engage the pads quicker.

Back brakes on Hondas kinda suck. The good news is, if you have it in 4wd, and lock up the front brakes, it's gonna lock up your rear wheels too since the final shaft that runs front and rear end is the same shaft.

Is the cam not keyed? I lined up the punch marks, and just assumed it would only go on one way. If I can do that, I definitely think it would help my cause.

 

[Jeepwm69]

Nope. You just pull the lever off, move it back a couple of teeth, and tap it back on.

 

[shadetree]

Nope. You just pull the lever off, move it back a couple of teeth, and tap it back on.

agreed ^^^^, very simple. couple teeth, tap back on, bolt it down, good to go.

 

[shadetree]

Yep, rotate the cam back a couple of teeth. It will give you more adjustment on the wingnuts and engage the pads quicker.

Back brakes on Hondas kinda suck. The good news is, if you have it in 4wd, and lock up the front brakes, it's gonna lock up your rear wheels too since the final shaft that runs front and rear end is the same shaft.

Is the cam not keyed? I lined up the punch marks, and just assumed it would only go on one way. If I can do that, I definitely think it would help my cause.

couple teeth, no more, or you won't be able to get the wing nuts back on the cable. MAKE SURE TO PULL THE CABLES BACK BY HAND TO REMOVE THE SLACK OUT, THEN EYE-BALL THE DISTANCE ON HOW FAR YOU CAN MOVE THE LEVER BACK. you can use the punch marks as a reference point.

 

[SamUK]

Just to add, make sure your lever on the handlebars has the adjuster screwed all the way in.

 

[shadetree]

Just to add, make sure your lever on the handlebars has the adjuster screwed all the way in.

some models don't have the adjuster on the lever. older models do for sure. but some newer models just stick into the lever right there, no adjuster.

 

[SamUK]

Just to add, make sure your lever on the handlebars has the adjuster screwed all the way in.

some models don't have the adjuster on the lever. older models do for sure. but some newer models just stick into the lever right there, no adjuster.

Ahh right, ok. Learn something new every day lol

 

[cjriddle22]

10-4.

Appreciate the help. I'll rotate the arm back a few teeth and see if that gets me what I need. I don't think I have an adjuster on the brake handle, but I'll verify.

 

[cjriddle22]

I was able to rotate the arm back a few teeth and it definitely tightened up the brakes, well at least the hand lever. The foot pedal is still really loose, and there isn't enough threads on the cable to tighten it up.

Attached are some pictures of the brake foot cable. The cable appears newish, so I'm thinking the previous owner replaced it with the wrong length cable. There is still a lot of slop in the foot cable. There appears to be some holders or brackets on the frame with nothing in them, should the foot cable be routed through them? The cable that's on there will not fit in the brackets.

Also attached is a picture of the used shoes, do they look warn enough to be replaced?

 

[DaBomb6988]

It maybe the wrong length cable. Run it through all holders and see if it's a better fit. If it's still to long I'd order a new cable. The shoes look OK. The top one is worn more than the bottom and needed to be replaced. (Not unless the pic is deceiving.) But your drum could still be out of spec. Hard telling how many shoes the drum has gone through also. Honda drum brakes suck. I honestly never use them because they are such a pain to keep in adjustment. I get mine to where the parking brake works and don't use them for anything other than that, parking. The front disc brakes are a lot easier and cheaper to maintain.

 

[cjriddle22]

It maybe the wrong length cable. Run it through all holders and see if it's a better fit. If it's still to long I'd order a new cable. The shoes look OK. The top one is worn more than the bottom and needed to be replaced. (Not unless the pic is deceiving.) But your drum could still be out of spec. Hard telling how many shoes the drum has gone through also. Honda drum brakes suck. I honestly never use them because they are such a pain to keep in adjustment. I get mine to where the parking brake works and don't use them for anything other than that, parking. The front disc brakes are a lot easier and cheaper to maintain.

So the cable should go through those holders? The cable or cable cover is too thick to squeeze in there.

The cable is like $7 to replace. I think I'm just going to order a new one and see how it goes.

Yeah I've already replaced the fronts. I had to replace one caliper because the previous owner stripped the allen heads on the pad pins and just left them in there all screwed up.

I'm beginning to question the previous owner on everything. The front calipers and brake lines had been off before because none of the brake lines were routed correctly or even screwed back into the frame. I just don't get how some people care so little.

 

[DaBomb6988]

Yes it should route through the holders. You may have to CAREFULLY open them up a little with a screwdriver if it's close to going in there. If they are way off then it's just the wrong cable. More than likely he used a cheap ebay cable or had one made at a parts store and that's where the fitment issues are from. Some people shouldn't have tools period.

 

[cjriddle22]

Sorry for the way late reply, but I hate to read through threads that never have a resolution.

I ended up just buying a new factory rear brake cable and replacing it. This fixed the issue. The other cable was almost exactly the same (different part numbers), but it was about 1" longer which is why I couldn't get it tightened up enough. I am assuming the previous owner just got a cable and didn't make sure it was the correct length.

Thanks for all the help.