[brad_0_trax]

I have a 99 450ES I am working on for a customer that did not shift with the ESP.
First of all I noticed, looked like speed sensor wires were broken.. Well, Fixed that.. no change.

I completely went through the testing diagram in the manual and finally got it figured out! It was broken wires from the shift button. Took a few hours and I was proud of myself for getting it straightened out! Well I rode it for about 2 days just being sure everything was good.. The next day I was going to tell him it was ready, I hopped on it and was going to take it down the road, turned the key on and it wouldn't shift. I was so mad.. I went back through all my repairs and it all checked out. Then i manually shifted it up in 1st, then back to N. Then i cut it off and went inside for an hour... Got back on it and it was doing perfect.. No issues. Well I continued to ride it trouble free for several hours. It was getting late so I went to bed... Next morning, same thing happened.. No shifting.. Cycled key, waited, plug and unplug the "change unit", and angle sensor, cycled key again, and nothing. The only fix is shifting from N to 1, back to N, then key cycle. Its very annoying... The shift motor works, angle sensor operated and tests as it should... The N and R light come on at the appropriate times, so it knows where its at. The combination meter is burned out, but that does not matter because its a stand alone unit. It only shows data, not processes it, to send somewhere else. Ive pulled all the related connections apart and cleaned them and whatnot, and Ive also got a known good spare "change unit." It acts up with both on it.

Im getting ready to tap into the 5V reference and hardwire the shift buttons! Lol. Not sure if thats even possible because of the polarity of the buttons and the shift motor. I believe the Change unit determines the polarity for up shift vs down shift.


ALSO, When testing and whatnot, I've figured out the system is VERY VERY sensitive. Say i backprope a wire on the shift motor to be sure its getting power with my meter, the system stops working. I stop, key cycle and it works fine.. probe the wires.. stops. I guess its picking up the resistance of the meter and thinking its a fault! Could my problem be an over or under voltage? If im not mistaken, ive seen anywhere from 7-8V between the orange/green shift motor wires at times... Just a thought... but that would be from the change unit??

I can unplug the N R Change switch while the bike is shifting, and it continues to shift, just no N and R light. SHifts fine from 1-5, then 5-R. Key cycle, and still shifts. I didnt think these would shift without a proper change switch (beside flywheel in motor) ?? Oh well.

I just cant seem to figure it out.
Yes, the angle sensor is fine.
The battery is new and good.
Emergency shift works.
When its not shifting it doesn't even try. I've checked with a meter, no power to motor. Plus there is no sound, zero. (so don't say clutch adjustment, its not applicable to the issue).

This is a 99, so it has no blink code system.

Ive never seen this happen. Ive only seen it Work or not work... never seen it sometimes work!

 

[brad_0_trax]

Update******

Now that ive been messing with it.. It stops working everytime i turn key off and back on.. I have to have key off, manual shift from N to 1 to N, then key cycle and then it works until i key cycle again.

 

[retro]

Those ES systems can be made to work great and be very reliable, but its a big project that most folks don't want to get involved in. Or they'll do a half-arsed job, cherry picking the easiest tasks and expect a big reward.

Start by taking both fenders off the bike. Then clean & dielectric grease every harness connector pair on the bike. Same for the grounds, all of them. Then buy a tub of NLGI #2 synthetic grease and disassemble the entire ES system and all of its components, including the shift motor, for cleaning and relubing with fresh syn grease. Pay attention to the reduction gears support bearings, many times one or more of them are installed crooked. Repack every one of them using a finger after cleaning all the old grease out of them. This link gives ya an idea how much work is involved and how much time is required (days, not hours) to do a thorough job:

https://www.hondaatvforums.net/foru...oes-terribly-wrong-long-post.html#post1244546

Follow the link inside that post and don't skip any part of it. Then let us know how it turned out for ya...

 

[subzerosoundman]

If you want to fix it in less than an hour, you can bypass the ECU shift computer. There is a video on youtube by Bubba Baryl:
Honda Rancher Shift Problems - How it works - How to fix ALL PROBLEMS!!!
It works for both the Rancher and the Foreman, and the shift buttons will work perfectly.