[machinecrook]

Back in 2015 I worked on the rear end of this machine. Had to get an aftermarket brake panel as well as a brake panel cover. Before I had consulted you guys here, I went ahead and bought some bearings/seals for the differential and brake panel. @shadetree clearly told me to not buy AllBalls as they were junk; it was too late my order was already placed.

Fast forward 4 years later, I hear a very faint grinding noise under the bike. Grinding probably isn't the correct term here, it's so faint you can barely notice it and only occurs when the bike is slightly twisting in between bumps. Now I clearly remember shadetree's advice and over the years I've read how he feels towards chinese junk - totally understand him as well. When I first purchased these parts I couldn't rub two pennies together; I had just bought a house and a woodlot.

I put the bike up on a step in order to verify what was going on. Here's what I found:

I can't get it to move front/backwards but upwards and downwards I can move it. Flushed the oil from the diff and there was no water. Still had oil in it.

I'm guessing a tear down is in store... Forgot to mention, I don't do any boating with it. I cross small mud spots in the trail and try to fix them up as much as possible as to minimize mud with the machine. Worst part of the year is the month of May. Mud never reaches the foot pegs though.

 

[Jeepwm69]

Bearings are shot. Take it apart, put new bearings in before things wear any more and it destroys the gears.

 

[_Wilson_]

A tad off topic, but That's the way to post! Details, DETAILS...

 

[machinecrook]

@Jeepwm69
Gahh not done my wood yet. I understand the urgency to fix this though... Balls! I mean, AllBalls are junk.
@_Wilson_
Thanks I try to make it as clear as possible

 

[machinecrook]

I can't seem to see the part #21 for the brake panel on partszilla. Seems to be a seal. I'll be replacing the bearings and seals while I'm at it. Don't want to have more downtime with my bike which means I'm not going to trust any other part in the kit I bought 4 years ago... Except the brake panel :|

Here's what I have planned for my purchase (crossing my fingers that nothing is wrong with the pinion bearing):
Rear Diff

• 
  2x bearing (91051-HC4-003)
  [*]1x dust seal (91252-HC4-003)
  [*]1x oil seal (91271-HC4-004)

Brake Panel

• 
  1x bearing (91052-HB3-771)
  [*]1x dust seal (91253-HC4-003)
  [*]1x ring seal (91351-HB3-004)

Only missing the part I mentioned at the begining of the post. Not sure I need the ring seal for the brake panel... Only a couple bucks so it's not so bad. I'm into it for a little over 150$... Do we have any discount with this forum on Partszilla? Perhaps someone knows of another site or a good quality kit for my exact situation?

 

[Manny]

Before I order any new bearings and seals I cross reference them at the local parts house. LOTS of times I can buy Timken for the same price or less then OEM.

just a thought.

 

[fishfiles]

All Balls makes me feel like I got tea bagged

Pivot Works has good bearings and seals , lifetime warranty 1 time , I would say they are better than OEM bearings , and I play in the water , sand and clay , it is $53 for this kit link below with free shipping --

don't skimp on changing that lower pinion bearing

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Pivot-Work...hash=item3cceba2d49:m:mG5hIY_UYMK5hnd-kjiX18Q

 

[Jeepwm69]

https://www.hondaatvforums.net/foru...ng-cross-reference-numbers-2.html#post1263850

I have had good results with Boss thus far, and also with Pivotworks. I'm not a fan of all balls.

That said, I have a sneaking suspicion that they're all coming out of the same place.

Pivotworks and All Balls are both owned by the same company. The Pivotworks have held up much better for me, but I think All Balls is their bargain line, and Pivotworks is the "little better but more expensive" line.

OEM will be Koyo or NTN, so if you want to do it once, I'd just OEM bearings. If you don't mind the job (it's pretty easy other than that inner pinion bearing) then you could save some money on a Boss or Pivotworks kit, and since you aren't a water rider they might last a long time.

 

[machinecrook]

Thanks guys.

The biggest pain in the butt for me is taking off those axle nuts. I don't have the tools to do it. I remember seeing @fishfiles having a specific tool for that job... Still got that pic?

I might just bite the bullet and buy me some big wrenches that fit on those nuts.

 

[Jeepwm69]

Thanks guys.

The biggest pain in the butt for me is taking off those axle nuts. I don't have the tools to do it. I remember seeing @fishfiles having a specific tool for that job... Still got that pic?

I might just bite the bullet and buy me some big wrenches that fit on those nuts.

I'm sure some of the "proper tool for the job" guys will wince at this, but I've found that my big Rigid pipe wrenches do the job. I've gotten away from stock 300/420 rear ends, so didn't see the need to buy/make a long impact socket to use on those nuts.

 

[fishfiles]

I don't know if you can even buy the ex-long deep socket to use on the axle nuts , you make it by cutting a socket in half and welding a piece of pipe in the middle of the two pieces , I think it is 41 mm and the equivalent in US is 1 5/8 ----I also have a 41 mm hammer wrench , where you can smack it with a maul

Jeep is right , a B.F. pipe wrench will get the job done , but leaves some nasty marks

 

[fishfiles]

That said, I have a sneaking suspicion that they're all coming out of the same place.
Pivotworks and All Balls are both owned by the same company.

I didn't know they both come from the same factory , I do know that PivotWorks is made into the metal of the bearings , would guess they have to do that as they offer a warranty and have to identify them , they do feel better in your hand

I never got one whole season and cheap front wheel bearings on my 300s , since I started using Pivot Works , I have not had to change or apply for the warranty yet , mu red 300 has got to be pushing 3 years on a set , our riding season is a lot longer than most , you can ride 52 weekends a year , but I don't ride the same bike every weekend , like to spread the wear around LOL

 

[Jeepwm69]

That said, I have a sneaking suspicion that they're all coming out of the same place.
Pivotworks and All Balls are both owned by the same company.

I didn't know they both come from the same factory , I do know that PivotWorks is made into the metal of the bearings , would guess they have to do that as they offer a warranty and have to identify them , they do feel better in your hand

I never got one whole season and cheap front wheel bearings on my 300s , since I started using Pivot Works , I have not had to change or apply for the warranty yet , mu red 300 has got to be pushing 3 years on a set , our riding season is a lot longer than most , you can ride 52 weekends a year , but I don't ride the same bike every weekend , like to spread the wear around LOL

I sent my first set of Pivotworks bearings in a few weeks ago. They were installed in 2014. They weren't terribly worn, but they were loose. The markings were worn off the bearings, but I knew which machine I'd installed them in, and it was also easy to verify since they don't have bearing seals like all the other aftermarkets.

Anyhow, I pulled them out, mailed them to Pivotworks, got a new set about 2-3 weeks afterwards. The return address on the package? All Balls Racing.

Anyhow, I have a set in the wife's 420, and I have a couple of 07-13 420 sets in the freezer, along with the replacement set of 500 Foreman bearings they sent me.

I ordered all of mine on Amazon so it's easy to pull up the receipt and print it off to send in when they need to be replaced.

They did last longer than anything else I've used except OEM.

 

[fishfiles]

Jeep , if the embossment of PivotWorks is worn off the race , as that is usually where it is , then I would think the race is loose in the bore and spinning in the bore for that to happen ?????

 

[fishfiles]

I was told by one of the Local dealers that Moose , All Balls and QuadBoss all come from the same place --------- I know from fishing , there is a lure called Salt Water Assassin , which works great for Speckled Trout and Redfish , the same lure is marketed by a different name in different parts of the country , Walleye Assassin and Bass Assassin are the same exact lures in a different bags

 

[Jeepwm69]

Jeep , if the embossment of PivotWorks is worn off the race , as that is usually where it is , then I would think the race is loose in the bore and spinning in the bore for that to happen ?????

It's been so long since I put them in I don't remember exactly where they were stamped. They were pretty nasty. I didn't add grease to them when I put them in, and lots of mud and water riding.

 

[machinecrook]

@Jeepwm69 @fishfiles

Grease them? You remove the seal from the brake panel bearing and apply grease to it, then place the seal back in? Same thing with the diff bearings (even though they dont have a seal)?

I think I'll go with OEM... Shipping up to Quebec takes about a month; I can't afford to wait that long for the next time it breaks. Haven't checked how long it is to get them from Partszilla though lol.

Last time I had to remove those axle nuts, I had to heat the nuts for a couple minutes, use a pipe wrench with a longer tube on it (making it a B.F pipe wrench) and use my Dad's 2ft adjustable wrench on the other nut. We applied a huge amount of force and they came off. Crossing my fingers they'll come off easier this time.

Thanks again for the input!

 

[machinecrook]

Parts purchased

Canadian funds... 30$ USD shipping. OEM better last me more than 4 years!!

 

[Jeepwm69]

Canadian funds... 30$ USD shipping. OEM better last me more than 4 years!!

Ouch!

When I said grease then, normally I pack good syn grease into wheel bearings before I install them, since the chinese yak fat doesn't even resemble grease, but since the Pivotworks wheel bearings have a lifetime warranty I didn't grease them, just left the factory stuff in there.

For diff bearings they're lubricated with gear oil so I wouldn't grease those. I would pack that bearing that goes in the brake backing plate.

 

[machinecrook]

Finally got the time to get started on this. Opened up my order from Partszilla and realized there was missing 1 o-ring. I was charged for it and actually had an o-ring shipped. However the shipped o-ring is a Yamaha genuine part; didn't notice when I first got the order a month ago. Argh, frustrating. Should've paid more attention when I first got it.

91354-HC4-901